So... if there are no points in Age of Sigmar?

General discussion about Warhammer Fantasy Battles
Bruno
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Re: So... if there are no points in Age of Sigmar?

Postby Bruno » Tue Jul 07, 2015 6:09 pm

Something floating around Twitter about army builds is using the Warscrolls. The example they listed is as follows;

1-12 Warscrolls
1-2 Hero Warscrolls
0-2 Monster Warscrolls
No single Warscroll my contain more than X wounds (i.e. 24)
Heroes may not be duplicated
All other Warscrolls may only be duplicated once

It is being said that with was from an email from GW HQ to shop employees. It is social media so it must be true lol. It does look like a solid way to build armies.

I will be at IOG on Saturday with my Orcs, I have to wash the dust off them first they have not see daylight in years.
Black Templar
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Re: So... if there are no points in Age of Sigmar?

Postby Black Templar » Tue Jul 07, 2015 8:57 pm

Or try this:

# of attacks ( every attack listed on a profile that you are using)+ # of wounds multiplied by the starting bravery per model.

Double the total for monster keyword and/or double the total for each warmachine. Random attacks are the average rounded up to the nearest whole number.

Then play something like 1500pt games.

It's work to figure it out but the folks at Mini War Gaming did a good battle report and it worked out.
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Re: So... if there are no points in Age of Sigmar?

Postby Julian » Wed Jul 08, 2015 4:24 pm

I've seen both methods, the points can be thrown off with certain units, and of course there are the rumors that GW will be putting in some balancing information later.

It is upsetting they did not include a way to balance the armies but I also didn't have to spend $85 for a rulebook and $50 for a codex so I could easily see in the future the rules being modified on the fly since they are free everyone can download the most updated version.

The 'friendly' game setup for me works well. We both bring what we have and counter deploy trying to drop something that matches what your opponent just put down. If everyone has a few heroes, a wizard, a monster, some war machines, and then infantry the game tends to balance itself out and if you play a game and something seems overpowered the games go fast and that unit can not be taken the next game or taken with something extra added to help counter it (yes, I would not take an overly powerful unit against an opponent that can't counter it, that's how I choose to play, to me some of my least fun games are when I just steamroll over the other player due to tactics, dice, army comp, etc) I'd rather play a close game that I lose than win a one sided match.

The part I like most is the removal of the 1+, 2+ saves, everything can wound everything else and every melee seems to result in removed models (there were just too many close combat tarpit fights in 8th where nothing got accomplished, if it was away from the rest of the battle it was annoying at times to go do the rolls remove 1-2 models on each side, declare a tie combat and move on). There are some unfair matchups, don't put your core troops up against a monster, they may wound it a bit but will probably get wrecked (or do it to tie it up and peel a few wounds off it so your hero or monster killing unit can come finish it off) but it depends on your tactical choices. Shooting is very relevant, no more shooting a whole unit of archers to kill 2 models (still can happen but these kills count against battleshock as well). Cavalry is nasty on the charge, as it should be.

All in all I find it fun and I like that if some army I don't collect puts out a cool unit of models I can grab em, paint em, and get em on the table for a game alongside what I do have. I do hope some sort of balancing/list creation guide comes down the line but even if GW doesn't do it the players will.
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Ninja Goblin
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Re: So... if there are no points in Age of Sigmar?

Postby Ninja Goblin » Fri Jul 10, 2015 3:45 am

I would be willing to rewrite a large scale fantasy game if Ian, Chris and others wanted to help. A homebrew to spread to the masses where 7th ed and 8th ed combine to be awesome! I watched a game of age of sigmar played and this is what I took from it:

2 nine year olds got together to play a game they just learned how to play at the game store,
They couldn't remember the rules so they just made a bunch up and used their warhammer minis.
They had a great time cause to be honest they are 9 and they can have fun in a farting match.
The game they played at the game store however is called
Warmachine and Hordes

I have been waiting for 9th ed for years, This game sucks donkey balls. Even if the rumors are true that the "new' releases wont have the little kid rules, the 4 pages of rules look and read like they were written on a lunch break with friends.

I am down for a beer and pretzels skirmish game but the fact that they just told 25+ years of a game to go fuck itself is a move I cannot be ok with and the only way I can show it is to vote with my wallet and get others to do the same. Even if wrath of kings is poor I will buy an army in support of large scale fantasy.

Love you all and miss those times more then I would like to admit.
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wilkinson73
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Re: So... if there are no points in Age of Sigmar?

Postby wilkinson73 » Fri Jul 10, 2015 8:50 am

Well I guess its a matter of attitude cause iv'e played fantasy for 20+ years and I dont feel I have been told to F**K off.
Bruno
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Re: So... if there are no points in Age of Sigmar?

Postby Bruno » Fri Jul 10, 2015 9:43 am

Ninja Gobo I would not run out and rewrite the rules yet. Today Kings of War 2.0 comes out today for free to download, I just checked and it is not available yet but should be by the end of the day. They stated they were going to add more depth to the game and I would not be surprised if it is what you are looking for. I also feel that GW is a money making machine and they want to sell models and I would not be surprised if they have a plan mapped out to make AoS much more. I am sure there will be more disappointment and excitement for the gaming community.
Julian
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Re: So... if there are no points in Age of Sigmar?

Postby Julian » Fri Jul 10, 2015 5:04 pm

I personally don't understand the hate, the rules are simple the players can balance it for themselves like they always have. Tournaments and competitive play always have modified the rules from the basic format, at least this way I didn't pay for a bunch of rules that are unusable, I got them for free and can easily modify them with my opponent to find a way to have fun. It may be no fun to those who want to find the loopholes and exploit rules in the name of competition. There are too many options to do so with the AOS rules so the only real option is to talk to your opponent and create a fun game. Watching a game of people trying to exploit the rules I agree is no fun, but get a good friend and try to counter each others units in deployment and then play a game, if you still don't like it play Kings of War, I played a game of it a while back and enjoyed it as well, it has point costs and some tactical depth but with fewer rules to try to exploit.

There are certain things that I didn't find fun with past versions of Warhammer and 40k but I found like minded people to play with and had a good time. Among my top pet peeves:

Bringing the latest OP list that was downloaded off the internet that features a nearly un-killable unit with the exact complement of magic items and heroes that kills everything it comes in contact with. I don't collect like this because I don't want to paint 50-100 of the same miniature when there are so many options in GW's range but I've seen it way to often in the 20 years I have been playing these games as some people don't show up to play games, they show up to beat someone else at something.

Bringing the sea of grey (or all white/black primer) plastic to play against my painted army (I'm not the greatest painter but it's part of the hobby and really ruins the game if one army just looks like garbage and is not finished) Not being able to finish new unit or two before a game is one thing but never bothering to do anything but assemble a huge army to me is retarded.

But I don't blame GW for creating the rules that allow these exploits, or for creating unpainted miniatures, in each choice the player made the decision on how they wanted to play the game,

Maybe GW will amend the rules, maybe they will issue more rules and campaigns to balance things, maybe they won't, but saying the game is unplayable is ridiculous, there are a million ways to exploit but don't look for the exploits and don't play against those who do, you will find that your games are closer and more fun even if you don't win all of them.
Bruno
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Re: So... if there are no points in Age of Sigmar?

Postby Bruno » Fri Jul 10, 2015 7:03 pm

There is an official looking errata floating around with some good changes. It also has three secnarios for people to play. It has an army organization and uses wounds for points. I still have not played so don't know if it will work.
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Charistoph
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Re: So... if there are no points in Age of Sigmar?

Postby Charistoph » Tue Jul 14, 2015 9:35 am

Black Templar wrote:Self-comp appears to be a 'must' ...but i'm OK with that. When I get a few games in I will post my experiences here as well.

-Jon


To be fair, there has always been a little "self-comp" in GW games. Major tournaments just started formalizing them, is all.

The lack of any official balance but "feel" is awkward, but my first tabletop game was Battletech 2nd & 3rd Edtion before the Battle Values started coming in. The only "balancing" in the game was tonnage and C-Bills, so It's not like this is new to me, just haven't been around it in a while.

Who knows, this may actually help me get off my duff and start collecting Fantasy models. The block sizes (and deciding on an army) were the biggest preventatives for me.
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wilkinson73
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Re: So... if there are no points in Age of Sigmar?

Postby wilkinson73 » Tue Jul 14, 2015 4:34 pm

My biggest draw is there are modles that I like from several armies. You can put them were you like. Without having to commit to a huge investment. So far the rules are simple. The depth comes in the war scrolls. But what this comes down too it social contract for mutual fun. the real reason I game. No points is great. I'm ok with it as long as someone doesn't pull a ducheface. Ie here are my 20 clan rats I'll match that with 20 greater demons. Lol I know that's extream but it serves a point to illustrate an example of fun vs hard core competition which has ruined me for 40k. I'll probably won't ever play it again because pick up games are disgustingly un fun vs most opponents.

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